DAVID DRUMM INTERVIEW: "SEÁN WAS on the receiving end of nothing – he was in control of everything."

That is the view of David Drumm, the former chief executive of Anglo Irish Bank who yesterday took the out-of-character decision to speak out publicly in an attempt to rebut claims made by his former boss, ex-Anglo chairman Seán FitzPatrick, in a new book.

In a series of interviews for the book, The FitzPatrick Tapes, FitzPatrick maintained the position he has held privately for some time – that he left the day-to-day management to Drumm after he moved from the role of chief executive to chairman of the State's third-largest bank in January 2005.

FitzPatrick claims he did not become aware of the bank’s dire funding position until just before the financial crisis peaked in September 2008; that the funding problem “wasn’t belted home to the board” before then and that Drumm was “running his own show” and “wasn’t welcoming” him into central matters at the bank.

In other words, FitzPatrick claims that Drumm, not him, was calling the shots at Anglo at a critical time for the survival of the bank.

Not so, claimed Drumm when contacted at his office in Boston by The Irish Timesyesterday.

“It is not credible that he didn’t know anything about the bank’s funding problem through 2008. That is just an unbelievable statement to make,” said Drumm. “He was in my office three to four times a day lecturing me about what I needed to do.”

FitzPatrick has also claimed that he was not told the names of the 10 customers assembled by the bank to prop up the bank’s share price in July 2008 by buying a 10 per cent stake held by businessman Seán Quinn.

All he wanted to know was that they were people of substance, FitzPatrick claimed. Drumm says FitzPatrick was told the names at the time in advance of the transaction.

Funding became a concern for the board of the bank early in the financial crisis in 2007, said Drumm, and remained on its agenda throughout 2008. At board meetings, which were chaired by FitzPatrick, throughout that year, executives made presentations on deposit and funding lines won and lost, said Drumm.

He said that FitzPatrick had also wrongly left the impression in the interviews that he played no part in his appointment as chief executive in January 2005.

“Seán left nothing to chance, and particularly not the appointment of his successor as CEO,” he said.

Drumm was not keen on taking over from FitzPatrick as he didn’t want “the public profile that came with it” and “knew following in Seán’s footsteps would be very difficult”. But FitzPatrick pressed him into it, he said.

“I would not have allowed my name to go forward for the position if Seán had not pushed me into it; Seán usually got what he wanted,” he said. “I most certainly would not have been appointed CEO if Seán didn’t want that. He had total control of the board.”

Drumm paints a picture of FitzPatrick as a figure who became dominant at the bank again as the crisis deteriorated in 2008.

“Seán is a very capable, driven and fastidious operator, and unmatched in Irish banking. But he was also very controlling – it comes with the territory,” he said.

Drumm claims FitzPatrick “more or less took charge again” following the failure of US bank Bear Stearns in March 2008 as Anglo’s share price was targeted by short-sellers.

These were investors who bet on a stock falling and they saw a chance to profit on a declining Irish property market and the bank’s massive exposure to Quinn.

“He had an office in the bank just down the hall from me and began to be there in the bank every day,” said Drumm.

“Perhaps his instincts kicked in and he could see trouble and couldn’t just stand by and be a spectator. Whatever his reasons, he became more and more involved, and began to interfere in the day-to-day executive decision-making.”

Drumm said FitzPatrick began to undermine his management of the bank and Anglo staff began to wonder who was in charge.

“It was not only affecting me, it was also causing significant frustration among the executive directors and senior executives as they were getting constant calls from him, second-guessing their actions and decisions,” he said.

“It also created uncertainty in people’s minds as Seán’s increasing involvement in the day-to-day operations naturally created concerns about what was happening to the bank.”

Relations became so strained that Drumm made a complaint about FitzPatrick to Anglo’s senior independent director Ned Sullivan in April 2008, saying he could not do his job properly. A week later, Drumm confronted FitzPatrick.

“I had a frank exchange with Seán on the matter during which I asked him to take an office outside the bank,” said Drumm. FitzPatrick never moved.

“Things did not change and the relationship between us did not improve,” added Drumm.

“Notwithstanding the strained relationship, both of us along with all the board members – executive and non-executive – were doing everything we could to face down the difficulties the bank was experiencing.”

Asked for a response to FitzPatrick’s comments, Drumm surprisingly chose to comment. He felt compelled to speak out, he said.

“I just want set the record straight,” he added.