Mr LOWRY told the tribunal that as chairman of the Fine Gael trustees he had taken part in a fund-raising effort that wiped out debts of Pounds 1.3 million. At the time, in 1993, the very future of the party was in question.
He said a lot of cant and hypocrisy had been spoken in recent months about political fund-raising. Since the State was founded the two major political parties had to a great extent depended on the corporate sector, and the system would have to be changed if this was not to continue.
Responding to Mr McCullough Mr Lowry said he was made chairman of the trustees of the Fine Gael party in 1993. Before that his involvement in party fund-raising was at constituency level.
In 1992, during a conversation with him, Mr Ben Dunne said he would be making some contributions in advance of the pending election. He would be giving Pounds 5,000 to Mr Lowry and he asked if Mr Lowry could facilitate his making contributions to Mr Michael Noonan and Mr Ivan Yates.
A few days later Mr Lowry called to the accounts office in Dunnes Stores head office, where three envelopes containing Pounds 5,000 each in cash were being held. One envelope was for him and one each for Mr Noonan and Mr Yates.
Arrangements were made for Mr Yates's envelope to be collected from a hotel in Dublin. Mr Lowry held on to Mr Noonan's envelope and gave it to him a week later.
Mr Lowry said these were the only payments he was aware of at the time by Mr Dunne to Fine Gael. He had never approached Mr Dunne seeking support. Mr Dunne had approached him.
Asked about introducing Mr Noonan to Mr Dunne, Mr Lowry rejected a suggestion that this might be to impress both men. "It wouldn't be as easy as that to impress them," he said.
Although he had few political conversations with Mr Dunne, he had conversations with him about Fine Gael's debts. When he was made chairman of the party trustees, the party had debts of Pounds 1.3 million and had paid Pounds 628,000 in interest between 1990 and 1993.
The party sent letters to the country's top 100 companies. "Dunes Stores just was one of those.
Mr Lowry said he had "heard a lot of cant and hypocrisy and a lot of political posturing from the political system themselves about political funding over the last number of months, and I would have to say that it is a fact that since the foundation of the State political parties have to a great extent, particularly Fianna Fail and Fine Gael, and more successfully Fianna Fail, have depended on the corporate and business sector to support them".
His attitude was that there was a price for democracy and if democracy was to be supported and sustained, it could be done only in that way. Otherwise the system would have to be changed.
Mr McCullough said Mr Lowry had organised a meeting between Mr Dunne and Mr John Bruton.
Mr Lowry said he had outlined the position of the Fine Gael party to Mr Dunne during a business conversation. Fine Gael had at the time "been in the doldrums" and had become "politically irrelevant" and was being written off.
The party membership was very demoralised. "Its very future was in question at that particular time."
He had approached Mr Dunne and explained the level of debt. Other members of the party were approaching other business people they knew with the same message.
He remembered Mr Dunne saying that when the country was going well Dunnes Stores was going well.
The country needed good government and a strong opposition was needed for that. Mr Dunne said he would make a political contribution.
Mr Bruton met Mr Dunne and Mr Dunne made a contribution of Pounds 30,000. The following year he made a contribution of Pounds 100,000.
Mr McCullough said it would be clear to Mr Dunne that the giving of Pounds 130,000 to Fine Gael would do Mr Lowry no harm within the party.
Mr Lowry said he would not put that construction on it. The response to the fund-raising effort meant the debt was eliminated, and within a short time the party was put in credit.
Mr McCullough said that would have stood to Mr Lowry's credit within the party that he could assist in getting such a large contribution from Mr Dunne.
Mr Lowry: "I called in every credit that was available to me in recent times and that didn't do me any good, did it?"
He was no longer a member of the party.