QUESTIONS & ANSWERS

Q My son got a much lower grade in one of his Leaving Cert subjects than his teachers had anticipated

Q My son got a much lower grade in one of his Leaving Cert subjects than his teachers had anticipated. He had always done well in that subject. An appeal failed to achieve an upgrading. Now, we wonder, where did he go wrong? Is there any way we can find this out? concerned parent, Dublin.

A You've certainly got a very topical question despite the fact that you sent it in before the present controversy over the Leaving Cert art grades arose

Generally speaking, I'm afraid, you cannot get any information on what he did or did not do in his exams the department of Education is prepared to undertake a recheck, but after that it will not release any marks or enter into any further discussions normally.

In the Sligo case, it required a lot of persistence from parents and teachers in the school to force a re appraisal of the art students' results after the re check stage. But they did succeed. So, I suppose the moral is that persistence can pay off.

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In your query you pointed out that the particular result in fact made no difference to your son, that he has got the college place he wanted in any case. But, he would, understandably, like to know where he went wrong and to get some idea of what he did in the exam which resulted in such a low grade.

That is a perfectly understandable reaction, indeed it is one I encounter from quite a lot of students and their parents. I also regularly hear teachers bemoan the fact that they have no idea where some particular student went wrong and that they would like to know to know if it was related in any way to their teaching.

I vividly recollect one teacher who had been getting consistently high grades in a particular subject and then suddenly in a year in which he saw no difference in ability levels among his students he had nothing above a C in his entire class he was devastated and had no way of finding out what had happened.

I can understand that it would be difficult for the Department if large numbers of parents or schools started to query results beyond the recheck stage. But it does seem to me that it would be reasonable to allow teachers to have access to students' exam papers at least the teachers could then see what the student had written and satisfy herself as to what had gone wrong. She could then brief the student.I would have thought that teachers should have a professional right to such access. It probably would involve them travelling to the exam branch of the department in Athlone to inspect a paper or papers, but that should not be a problem.

At the moment the exams exist in a sort of vacuum. Students spend six years working for the Leaving, they are examined over an intensive period of a few days and neither they nor the schools gets any feed back other than the bare grades. Perhaps you should write to the Minister for Education suggesting this.

Q Could you please tell me if it is possible for me to sit pass Leaving Cert Irish at the end of fifth year so that can get it out of the way to give myself more time for studying my other subjects next year? Dublin 14 fifth year student.

A I'm afraid not. There has always been a ruling that a student should have followed the course for a minimum of two years before sitting the Leaving Cert. I don't know why perhaps they wanted to prevent people cramming like mad in one year.

The regulation, however, was never seriously enforced and in recent years the tradition grew up in a number of schools whereby the students did sit Irish in fifth year to get it out of the way. Strictly speaking school principals should not have entered such students for the exam, but it seemed that a blind eye was turned.

In the meantime, however, the Minister has sent out a new circular forbidding schools from engaging in this practice and, as far as I am aware, most schools have now dropped the practice of entering fifth year students for Leaving Cert Irish. The new circular was partly tied in with the Transition Year the Minister was concerned that schools might sneakily use the Transition Year to prepare students for some Leaving Cert subjects the following year.

Q My daughter accepted a course in Trinity in September but dropped out before Christmas realising it was the wrong one for her. We had paid the half fees by then. My query now is if she gets a place on a different course next year, will she have her fees paid? Co Galway mother.

A She's clearly going to be a borderline case. Normally, someone who has done first year already will not have his or her fees paid to do another first year even is she had failed the first one or paid her own fees.

However, dropping out in the first term is usually regarded as not actually having done the year, so it seems to me that you should stand a good chance of getting her fees paid. What you will have to do is to raise the matter with the fees office of the college where she gets offered a place.

What you don't tell me is whether she told Trinity immediately that she was dropping out, if she notified them officially. If she didn't, then it is possible that the Department of Education may have paid the second half of her fees to Trinity if this is the case, then you will have difficulty arguing for free fees status for her next year. But, if she did notify them, then it seems to me that she should be in a good position to have her fees paid.

Q I am a qualified secondary teacher and have done remedial teaching in England. I would like to train as a primary teacher or for secondary remedial teaching here. But I find myself in a vicious circle needing honours Irish for the first and would already have to be a remedial teacher to qualify for a remedial teaching course. What can I do? Co Limerick teacher.

A Talk about a Catch 22 It is, of course, absurd, but that is the way it operates. We have a shortage of primary teachers, schools simply cannot get qualified substitute teachers, yet the scheme to train secondary teachers for primary school work in one year does indeed require that you have honours Irish in your Leaving Cert.

This, despite the fact, that you already have a BA, an MA and H.Dip as well as teaching experience in England. I understand why they insist on honours Irish for the initial three year teacher training course. But if we are short of teachers and are mounting a crash course to train graduates as primary teachers surely it should he possible to include the equivalent of honours Irish in the training course? After all, people who train as primary teachers in Britain and Northern Ireland are accepted as fully fledged teachers without honours Irish, provided they sit a special Irish exam.

With regard to the remedial teaching, this has been a problem for many years. The policy has been to accept mainly those who are already doing remedial teaching or been designated by their school to do so onto the one year remedial teacher training courses.

There is a certain logic to this in the sense that otherwise there is a danger that the course would become just another post graduate option and be swamped with freshly emerging graduates. The thinking is that people should have some teaching experience before they go into remedial work. This is reasonable but it seems to me that your experience of special needs teaching in England should be taken into account.

You say in your letter that remedial posts are being advertised which you would be well equipped to undertake, but they all specify a remedial teaching qualification. Try making a special plea to the colleges providing remedial teacher courses or contact the Remedial Teachers' Association, c/o The Teachers' Centre, Drumcondra, Dublin 9. They may be able to advise you.